LSL Guide to URM Applying

Admissions strategy and application process for URM applicants.
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soca_dancer
Posts: 79
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2018 10:27 am

LSL Guide to URM Applying

Post by soca_dancer » Fri Jan 26, 2018 11:51 am

Hi all, I though it would be great to have a comprehensive post detailing what a URM application cycle may look like, enjoy!

Application Submission Timeline:
It is advised that URMs apply earlier in the application cycle, for applying purposes this means August through November (Thanksgiving). This is especially important if you are below one or both 25th percentiles. But if you can't make this deadline, its not all over. The application cycle is long, see Admissions Decision Timeline below.

Materials:

(1) Personal Statements - usually 1-2 pages, double spaced, no less than 11 point font*
- This statement can cover anything about yourself that you would like to share with the admissions committee: overcoming obstacles, a singular
event/circumstance that greatly affected you; your favorite activity that greatly effected you, etc. Whatever you decide it is highly advisable
to tie some section of this essay into why you want to go to law school/have a legal career - but not mandatory.

(2) Diversity Statement - usually 1 page, double spaced, no less than 11 pt font*
- This statement should cover any obstacles/challenges caused by any of the following (this is not an exhaustive list): socioeconomic status,
ethnicity/race, first generation status, gender, sexual orientation, etc. Further this statement should include a detailed explanation of how
these challenges/obstacles were overcome. Although you may include pieces of this information in tour personal statement, it is important for
URMs to have a separate statement that includes a deep-dive into these issues. You want the adcoms to really gain a sense of who you are as a
complete applicant.

(3) Why X Essays - usually 1 page, double spaced, no less than 11 pt font*
- Many URMs do not take advantage of this important component of the application. Especially if you are below one or both 25th percentiles, it is advised to write a statement detailing what draws you to that school particularly. It could be programmatic offerings, clinics, professors, classes, their affinity group's reputation, location, alumni base in city of choice, etc. Including a statement that really portrays you've done your research will illustrate to the adcoms you are interested in their school and they should take a strong look at your application.

*please check each school's specific application instructions as these are just guidelines.

(4) Other School Related Supplemental Essays

(5) Transcripts - Try to order these as early as you can.

(6) Letter of Recommendations - Ask for these early. Try asking for these in the summer as more professors have available free time and can give you a faster turn around.

Interviews/Adcom Dinners:
During the application cycle you will have to be interviewed by many adcoms or even attend interview dinners. Be professional, courteous, and not afraid to communicate. An interview is good, they are interested, know that you are worth it.

- Schools that commonly interview applicants: UVA, Chicago, Harvard, Cornell
- Schools that sometimes interview applicants: Upenn, Columbia

Admissions Decision Timeline:
The law school application process is grueling. Admissions decisions start to go out in August (UVA, UCLA) through the fall semester and generally end by April of the following year (shout out to Harvard, Yale, and Non-PT Duke). Most movement occurs between November and February.

ASW Visits:
Email the school's admissions office to determine if there is financial assistance for travelling to ASWs. These travel costs typically only cover transportation to and from the school's city. If accommodation costs are equally a concern, email the school's affinity group (Black Law Students, Latino Law Students, Women Law Student, etc.) to ask if a member of their organization can host you.

Financial Aid:
It is important to have your required financial aid documents available and in order to ensure you can submit aid applications as early as possible.

(1) FAFSA
(2) CSS Profile - this is school dependent, I would wait until you get accepted to submit this form as it costs $
(3) School aid application
(4) Prior year tax forms - some schools may ask for current year tax figures
(5) Non-custodial request and 3rd party supplements
- If you come from a single parent houseshold and you have no contact with the noncustodial parent (the one who is not in your life), you must
write a letter that details the circumstances of this non-existent relationship and provide supporting documentation i.e. court order, third-
party letter (from clergy, school counselor, therapist, etc.) detailing their knowledge of this.

Scholarships:
- SEO (fellowship and scholarship)
- Apply to Programmatic Scholarships at schools
- ABA Legal Opportunity Fund
- NAACP Legal Defense Fund (especially if you want to work in PI)
- Hispanic College Fund
- there are many more, so do your research.
Last edited by soca_dancer on Fri Jan 26, 2018 12:37 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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principalagent
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Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2018 9:18 am

Re: Guide to URM Applying

Post by principalagent » Fri Jan 26, 2018 12:07 pm

Omg bae did you make this yourself? Amazing

soca_dancer
Posts: 79
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2018 10:27 am

Re: Guide to URM Applying

Post by soca_dancer » Fri Jan 26, 2018 12:26 pm

Haha yeah, I had a lot of time to kill at work. Pay it forward

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Experiment626
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Re: LSL Guide to URM Applying

Post by Experiment626 » Fri Jan 26, 2018 1:30 pm

Thanks for doing this! This is the content we need to replace if we can't get OPs to transfer it to here/their permission.

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Barack O'Drama
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Re: LSL Guide to URM Applying

Post by Barack O'Drama » Fri Jan 26, 2018 6:01 pm

Thank you for this!

StayWokeSis
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Re: LSL Guide to URM Applying

Post by StayWokeSis » Sun Jan 28, 2018 7:21 am

Wish I had this a few years ago :-D :-D

Thanks!

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xdocs
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Re: LSL Guide to URM Applying

Post by xdocs » Sun Feb 04, 2018 10:29 am

I was thinking that the OP could use some stats for URM's, or guidelines on where to apply. something like this famous tls thread http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... p?t=195443.

Besides the OP in that thread there are also some great gems within the comments like this one from Rawls:
John_rizzy_rawls wrote:FWIW, I did some playing around on LSN and found that a 3.55+ and a 172+ is auto-admit at Harvard, based on the last decade's online statistics, 37 admits, 1 denial (that was a 3.8+ GPA - must have been a glaring app weakness/significant C&F issue/PS written in crayon).

Since 2005/2006, those numbers are 100% admit at Harvard, 75% at Yale and 70% at Stanford.
Since the law school bubble burst (2008/2009), those numbers for URMs are 100% Harvard, 80% Yale, 70% Stanford.

If that doesn't give URMs something to shoot for, then I just don't know what is.

Now all there is to do is slay myself for a 2+ point increase on my June 2013 retake. And maintain my 3.6+ GPA. Oy.
This Amicus brief also has some really great tables https://www.americanbar.org/content/dam ... eckdam.pdf

Particularly on page 21 it has a table that shows that from 2006 to 2010 of applicants who had a 165+ and a 3.5+ just 1% were AA applicants, and 3% were Hispanic applicants. So URM applicants who score in this range usually have great options.


I can start trying to create an updated version of some of this material, and adding in links to third sources here if you want to add it to the op.

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FRESH
Posts: 3
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Re: LSL Guide to URM Applying

Post by FRESH » Sun Feb 04, 2018 11:50 am

xdocs wrote:
Sun Feb 04, 2018 10:29 am
I was thinking that the OP could use some stats for URM's, or guidelines on where to apply. something like this famous tls thread http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... p?t=195443.

Besides the OP in that thread there are also some great gems within the comments like this one from Rawls:
John_rizzy_rawls wrote:FWIW, I did some playing around on LSN and found that a 3.55+ and a 172+ is auto-admit at Harvard, based on the last decade's online statistics, 37 admits, 1 denial (that was a 3.8+ GPA - must have been a glaring app weakness/significant C&F issue/PS written in crayon).

Since 2005/2006, those numbers are 100% admit at Harvard, 75% at Yale and 70% at Stanford.
Since the law school bubble burst (2008/2009), those numbers for URMs are 100% Harvard, 80% Yale, 70% Stanford.

If that doesn't give URMs something to shoot for, then I just don't know what is.

Now all there is to do is slay myself for a 2+ point increase on my June 2013 retake. And maintain my 3.6+ GPA. Oy.
This Amicus brief also has some really great tables https://www.americanbar.org/content/dam ... eckdam.pdf

Particularly on page 21 it has a table that shows that from 2006 to 2010 of applicants who had a 165+ and a 3.5+ just 1% were AA applicants, and 3% were Hispanic applicants. So URM applicants who score in this range usually have great options.


I can start trying to create an updated version of some of this material, and adding in links to third sources here if you want to add it to the op.
That would be awesome if you could.

papaya
Posts: 104
Joined: Tue Jan 30, 2018 12:11 pm

Re: LSL Guide to URM Applying

Post by papaya » Mon Feb 05, 2018 4:15 pm

xdocs wrote:
Sun Feb 04, 2018 10:29 am
I was thinking that the OP could use some stats for URM's, or guidelines on where to apply. something like this famous tls thread http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... p?t=195443.

Besides the OP in that thread there are also some great gems within the comments like this one from Rawls:
John_rizzy_rawls wrote:FWIW, I did some playing around on LSN and found that a 3.55+ and a 172+ is auto-admit at Harvard, based on the last decade's online statistics, 37 admits, 1 denial (that was a 3.8+ GPA - must have been a glaring app weakness/significant C&F issue/PS written in crayon).

Since 2005/2006, those numbers are 100% admit at Harvard, 75% at Yale and 70% at Stanford.
Since the law school bubble burst (2008/2009), those numbers for URMs are 100% Harvard, 80% Yale, 70% Stanford.

If that doesn't give URMs something to shoot for, then I just don't know what is.

Now all there is to do is slay myself for a 2+ point increase on my June 2013 retake. And maintain my 3.6+ GPA. Oy.
This Amicus brief also has some really great tables https://www.americanbar.org/content/dam ... eckdam.pdf

Particularly on page 21 it has a table that shows that from 2006 to 2010 of applicants who had a 165+ and a 3.5+ just 1% were AA applicants, and 3% were Hispanic applicants. So URM applicants who score in this range usually have great options.


I can start trying to create an updated version of some of this material, and adding in links to third sources here if you want to add it to the op.
Hm, so i did a little number crunching with LSN numbers with all the data (going back to 2003).

For URMs at >=3.75 AND >=170 , the share of URMs who applied and were accepted to Yale was 23% (including those accepted off waitlist). for stanford, that was a little above 30%. That's not by cycle that's for the total over all ~15 years of data, and general caveats about self selection on LSN.

These numbers dont change much for LSAT at 172 so I'm not seeing how John_rizzy_rawls go those numbers. but either way, those %s are still huge compared to the general acceptance rate so it's still nice!

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xdocs
Posts: 22
Joined: Sat Jan 27, 2018 10:46 am

Re: LSL Guide to URM Applying

Post by xdocs » Mon Feb 05, 2018 4:45 pm

papaya wrote:
Mon Feb 05, 2018 4:15 pm
Hm, so i did a little number crunching with LSN numbers with all the data (going back to 2003).

For URMs at >=3.75 AND >=170 , the share of URMs who applied and were accepted to Yale was 23% (including those accepted off waitlist). for stanford, that was a little above 30%. That's not by cycle that's for the total over all ~15 years of data, and general caveats about self selection on LSN.

These numbers dont change much for LSAT at 172 so I'm not seeing how John_rizzy_rawls go those numbers. but either way, those %s are still huge compared to the general acceptance rate so it's still nice!
I think the rawls numbers are just for AA aplicants not all Urm's. I could be wrong though

soca_dancer
Posts: 79
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2018 10:27 am

Re: LSL Guide to URM Applying

Post by soca_dancer » Mon Feb 05, 2018 4:51 pm

Thanks for the post @ xdocs, very fruitful information. You should definitely create a thread about this sub topic, I’ll be able to use some of the links but won’t add the TLS link to the OP as I don’t want to send any traffic to HB and assoc. I would def encourage you to create that new thread there seems to be a lot of interest.

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greatspirit
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Re: LSL Guide to URM Applying

Post by greatspirit » Tue Mar 13, 2018 9:49 am

Prior year’s tax documents?

So as someone applying over the 2018-2019 cycle, I only have to submit calendar year 2017 tax documents of my own and my single parents?

Also thanks for mentioning that “non custodial” letter - hadnt even thought of that.

soca_dancer
Posts: 79
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2018 10:27 am

Re: LSL Guide to URM Applying

Post by soca_dancer » Thu Mar 15, 2018 9:04 am

Depending on the school, if you’re applying before April 15th and won’t have your 2017 taxes completed, you can submit 2016.

Agonmom
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Joined: Tue Mar 06, 2018 4:59 pm

Re: LSL Guide to URM Applying

Post by Agonmom » Thu Mar 15, 2018 9:46 am

soca_dancer wrote:
Fri Jan 26, 2018 11:51 am

(3) Why X Essays - usually 1 page, double spaced, no less than 11 pt font*
- Many URMs do not take advantage of this important component of the application. Especially if you are below one or both 25th percentiles, it is advised to write a statement detailing what draws you to that school particularly. It could be programmatic offerings, clinics, professors, classes, their affinity group's reputation, location, alumni base in city of choice, etc. Including a statement that really portrays you've done your research will illustrate to the adcoms you are interested in their school and they should take a strong look at your application.

*please check each school's specific application instructions as these are just guidelines.
Hey, @soca_dancer thank you for this informative post! I am wondering if you submitted a "Why X" with every single application you submitted? Did you submit this in lieu of any addendum or in addition to? I really wish I had known this before submitting my applications! Thanks again. :)

soca_dancer
Posts: 79
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2018 10:27 am

Re: LSL Guide to URM Applying

Post by soca_dancer » Thu Mar 15, 2018 11:18 pm

I did submit it with every app. I don’t have traditional numbers so it was cautionary for me. I submitted them as additional addendum, I think they really helped in my case. The schools got to see I did my research and had grounded reasons for wanting to go.

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