Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2018 rolling out + C/O 2012-2017 data

Discuss comparisons of various school choices and the various metrics that inform them, including rankings, student life, location, etc.
NukinFutz
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2017 rolling out + C/O 2012-2016 data

Post by NukinFutz » Thu Apr 19, 2018 1:30 am

MT Cicero wrote:
Wed Apr 18, 2018 12:31 pm
And finally...

Iowa - 19.0%

(26/137) (-7.0% from 2016)

BL: 12.4% (17)
FC: 6.6% (9)
Ouch! Why are they ranked so high? Honest question.

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icechicken
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2017 rolling out + C/O 2012-2016 data

Post by icechicken » Thu Apr 19, 2018 10:08 am

NukinFutz wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 1:30 am
MT Cicero wrote:
Wed Apr 18, 2018 12:31 pm
And finally...

Iowa - 19.0%

(26/137) (-7.0% from 2016)

BL: 12.4% (17)
FC: 6.6% (9)
Ouch! Why are they ranked so high? Honest question.
US News doesn’t care about this metric but it cares a lot about these three: Medians, resources, reputation. Iowa historically does well at those things.

And it’s worth nothing they also took a significant hit in the US News rankings this year.

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principalagent
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2017 rolling out + C/O 2012-2016 data

Post by principalagent » Thu Apr 19, 2018 10:22 am

And Iowa’s FTLT, which USNews does take into account, is pretty good because it’s the only school in the state and is small, so it’s sourcing an appropriate amount of lawyers for the area and competition for the variety of jobs in the state is relatively low.

BearCat
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2017 rolling out + C/O 2012-2016 data

Post by BearCat » Sat Apr 21, 2018 4:15 pm

I still find WUSTL and Vandy's numbers thoroughly shocking. I thought WUSTL going from like mid-30's to 45% last year was a fluke in part due to a small class that year, and that it would go down, but no, it's going up. Can guarantee you guys that there are no more STL jobs now than there were a few years ago.

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anon
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2017 rolling out + C/O 2012-2016 data

Post by anon » Sat Apr 21, 2018 10:15 pm

Maybe NYC just being hot right now, considering the overall increase in t14 numbers? Definitely going to consider mailing/networking NYC from my t20.

181plz
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2017 rolling out + C/O 2012-2016 data

Post by 181plz » Sun Apr 22, 2018 10:36 am

principalagent wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 10:22 am
And Iowa’s FTLT, which USNews does take into account, is pretty good because it’s the only school in the state and is small, so it’s sourcing an appropriate amount of lawyers for the area and competition for the variety of jobs in the state is relatively low.
Hey, Drake University doesn’t like this comment.

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principalagent
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2017 rolling out + C/O 2012-2016 data

Post by principalagent » Sun Apr 22, 2018 10:44 am

181plz wrote:
Sun Apr 22, 2018 10:36 am
Hey, Drake University doesn’t like this comment.
:oops:

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MT Cicero
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2017 rolling out + C/O 2012-2016 data

Post by MT Cicero » Thu Apr 26, 2018 12:33 am

So, to circle back to me shamelessly repping my school, and how the JD-MBA folks skew our BL + FC percentage a few points each year, here are the JD-only numbers:

Northwestern - 72.3%

(159/220) (+1.0% from 2016)

BL: 63.6% (140)
FC: 8.6% (19)

There were 28 JD-MBAs out of a total class size of 248 (11.3% of the class), and only 13 went into bar passage jobs (12 BL, 1 PI). When removing them from the numerator and denominator, NU jumps 3.3% this year. Also, the streak of 0 clerks (federal or state) for JD-MBAs extends to 7 years.

Link: http://www.law.northwestern.edu/profess ... ts/jd-mba/

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SmokeytheBear
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2017 rolling out + C/O 2012-2016 data

Post by SmokeytheBear » Thu Apr 26, 2018 7:39 am

MT Cicero wrote:
Thu Apr 26, 2018 12:33 am
So, to circle back to me shamelessly repping my school, and how the JD-MBA folks skew our BL + FC percentage a few points each year, here are the JD-only numbers:

Northwestern - 72.3%

(159/220) (+1.0% from 2016)

BL: 63.6% (140)
FC: 8.6% (19)

There were 28 JD-MBAs out of a total class size of 248 (11.3% of the class), and only 13 went into bar passage jobs (12 BL, 1 PI). When removing them from the numerator and denominator, NU jumps 3.3% this year. Also, the streak of 0 clerks (federal or state) for JD-MBAs extends to 7 years.

Link: http://www.law.northwestern.edu/profess ... ts/jd-mba/
Yeah I mean I’ve been wanting to poke holes in this obsession with BL plus FC for a couple weeks now, as it is somewhat misleading for reasons I have already discussed, and because it lumps together different people into one category (as you noted).

But it’s more or less the law school equivalent of GDP—can be deconstructed and is somewhat misleading, but still highly useful.

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MT Cicero
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2017 rolling out + C/O 2012-2016 data

Post by MT Cicero » Thu Apr 26, 2018 11:29 am

SmokeytheBear wrote:
Thu Apr 26, 2018 7:39 am
MT Cicero wrote:
Thu Apr 26, 2018 12:33 am
So, to circle back to me shamelessly repping my school, and how the JD-MBA folks skew our BL + FC percentage a few points each year, here are the JD-only numbers:

Northwestern - 72.3%

(159/220) (+1.0% from 2016)

BL: 63.6% (140)
FC: 8.6% (19)

There were 28 JD-MBAs out of a total class size of 248 (11.3% of the class), and only 13 went into bar passage jobs (12 BL, 1 PI). When removing them from the numerator and denominator, NU jumps 3.3% this year. Also, the streak of 0 clerks (federal or state) for JD-MBAs extends to 7 years.

Link: http://www.law.northwestern.edu/profess ... ts/jd-mba/
Yeah I mean I’ve been wanting to poke holes in this obsession with BL plus FC for a couple weeks now, as it is somewhat misleading for reasons I have already discussed, and because it lumps together different people into one category (as you noted).

But it’s more or less the law school equivalent of GDP—can be deconstructed and is somewhat misleading, but still highly useful.
Yeah, exactly. It's a good enough proxy to differentiate larger swaths of schools in decision-making. Tougher at the finer details without more.

Also, I think c/o 2017 was NU's last year with the 2-year AJD program as graduates. Wonder if we'll see any difference going forward, since they did OCI like 2.5 months after starting classes in May (not sure how they fared overall, but seemed to do about the same as the JDs in my anecdotal observations).

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SmokeytheBear
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2017 rolling out + C/O 2012-2016 data

Post by SmokeytheBear » Thu Apr 26, 2018 11:31 am

MT Cicero wrote:
Thu Apr 26, 2018 11:29 am
SmokeytheBear wrote:
Thu Apr 26, 2018 7:39 am
MT Cicero wrote:
Thu Apr 26, 2018 12:33 am
So, to circle back to me shamelessly repping my school, and how the JD-MBA folks skew our BL + FC percentage a few points each year, here are the JD-only numbers:

Northwestern - 72.3%

(159/220) (+1.0% from 2016)

BL: 63.6% (140)
FC: 8.6% (19)

There were 28 JD-MBAs out of a total class size of 248 (11.3% of the class), and only 13 went into bar passage jobs (12 BL, 1 PI). When removing them from the numerator and denominator, NU jumps 3.3% this year. Also, the streak of 0 clerks (federal or state) for JD-MBAs extends to 7 years.

Link: http://www.law.northwestern.edu/profess ... ts/jd-mba/
Yeah I mean I’ve been wanting to poke holes in this obsession with BL plus FC for a couple weeks now, as it is somewhat misleading for reasons I have already discussed, and because it lumps together different people into one category (as you noted).

But it’s more or less the law school equivalent of GDP—can be deconstructed and is somewhat misleading, but still highly useful.
Yeah, exactly. It's a good enough proxy to differentiate larger swaths of schools in decision-making. Tougher at the finer details without more.

Also, I think c/o 2017 was NU's last year with the 2-year AJD program as graduates. Wonder if we'll see any difference going forward, since they did OCI like 2.5 months after starting classes in May (not sure how they fared overall, but seemed to do about the same as the JDs in my anecdotal observations).
Oh wow right. Totally forgot about those guys. I am VERY curious about their employment stats.

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Mikey
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2017 rolling out + C/O 2012-2016 data

Post by Mikey » Thu Apr 26, 2018 4:03 pm

LST seems to have updated employment stats! :mrgreen:

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Stranger
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2017 rolling out + C/O 2012-2016 data

Post by Stranger » Mon Jul 09, 2018 2:06 pm

Stranger wrote:
Wed Apr 18, 2018 2:52 pm
New Spreadsheet for Nebby's OP
MT Cicero wrote:
SmokeytheBear wrote:
Circling back to the Northwestern JD-MBA discussion, I used the Wayback Machine to get the joint numbers going back to 2012, and made a new row in my spreadsheet for the non-joint JD grads. It illustrates that, for the average law student, Northwestern has pretty typical t13 employment outcomes. Also, the 3% deviation in BL+FC when you take out the JD-MBA grads appears to be typical for NU.

Dough-Bear
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2017 rolling out + C/O 2012-2016 data

Post by Dough-Bear » Wed Apr 03, 2019 10:09 am

Vandy c/o 2018 is out

179 grads
97 in Big Law = 54.189%
18 fed clerkships = 10.05 %

BL + FC = 115 / 179 = 64.245 %

https://law.vanderbilt.edu/2018-EmploymentSummary.pdf

Dough-Bear
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2017 rolling out + C/O 2012-2016 data

Post by Dough-Bear » Wed Apr 03, 2019 10:12 am

Penn c/o 2018

243 grads
BL = 177 / 243 = 72.83 %
FC = 18 / 243 = 7.4 %
BL + FC = 195 / 243 = 80.24 %

https://www.law.upenn.edu/live/files/92 ... summarypdf

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Stranger
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2017 rolling out + C/O 2012-2016 data

Post by Stranger » Wed Apr 03, 2019 11:18 am

It begins! I'll look at updating my spreadsheet once we have a few more of these.

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Nebby
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2017 rolling out + C/O 2012-2016 data

Post by Nebby » Wed Apr 03, 2019 11:51 am

Alright fam. Can you format your post to match OP so I can easily copy and paste?

bananasplitters
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2018 rolling out + C/O 2012-2017 data

Post by bananasplitters » Wed Apr 03, 2019 7:57 pm

Iowa is out

Big Law: 23/141 = 16.3% (12.4% for 2017)
Fed Clerk: 7/141 = 5.0% (6.6%)

BL/FC = 21.3% (19%)

Bar Passage Required jobs went from 77.4% ---> 87.2% (123/141) this year :o
FWIW, that number is ~10% higher than Iowa has ever been, and would have been higher than every non-T14 school last year, and slightly above Harvard.


https://law.uiowa.edu/sites/law.uiowa.e ... f_2018.pdf

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MT Cicero
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2017 rolling out + C/O 2012-2016 data

Post by MT Cicero » Wed Apr 03, 2019 8:27 pm

Nebby wrote:
Wed Apr 03, 2019 11:51 am
Alright fam. Can you format your post to match OP so I can easily copy and paste?
I like the full info everyone's posting, but make sure to include the Nebby version (as quoted here) so he can easily copy paste. Just throw it at the bottom of the post.

Nebby, here's the easy version of the three posted so far:

Vanderbilt - 63.1%
Penn - 80.2%
Iowa = 21.3%

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Stranger
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2018 rolling out + C/O 2012-2017 data

Post by Stranger » Wed Apr 03, 2019 9:33 pm

LSU - 16.5%

Not sure if we care at that level, but they did get a rather nice 80.0% FTLT Bar Passage Required rate.


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Stranger
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2018 rolling out + C/O 2012-2017 data

Post by Stranger » Thu Apr 04, 2019 8:23 pm

Emory - 42.1%

Hot damn! Only 74.8% FTLT Bar Passage Required, though.



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Platopus
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Re: Employment Statistics by School - C/O 2018 rolling out + C/O 2012-2017 data

Post by Platopus » Thu Apr 04, 2019 11:18 pm

Do these numbers assume that BigLaw = 250+ or 100+?

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