Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Discuss comparisons of various school choices and the various metrics that inform them, including rankings, student life, location, etc.
User avatar
RubyRhad
Posts: 933
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2018 10:04 am

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by RubyRhad » Sun Mar 18, 2018 11:15 am

wsbl wrote:
Sat Mar 17, 2018 9:52 pm
alykdesire wrote:
Sat Mar 17, 2018 8:57 pm
How viable is it to go to Texas after graduation? Is self-selection that a small percentage of students (2.8%) go there after law school?
It's difficult to give a helpful answer to this question other than to say that not many are aiming to go to Texas from Penn, but that still there are a number who will be doing so for SA or post-graduation (think top 10 firms in Houston).
Okay thanks. Are there a decent number of Texas firms that participate in OCI? I'm also considering UVA and I know they have good connections to Texas. Wondering if Penn has the same ties.

User avatar
goat.parkour
Posts: 16
Joined: Sat Jan 27, 2018 12:00 am

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by goat.parkour » Sun Mar 18, 2018 4:15 pm

alykdesire wrote:
Sun Mar 18, 2018 11:15 am
wsbl wrote:
Sat Mar 17, 2018 9:52 pm
alykdesire wrote:
Sat Mar 17, 2018 8:57 pm
How viable is it to go to Texas after graduation? Is self-selection that a small percentage of students (2.8%) go there after law school?
It's difficult to give a helpful answer to this question other than to say that not many are aiming to go to Texas from Penn, but that still there are a number who will be doing so for SA or post-graduation (think top 10 firms in Houston).
Okay thanks. Are there a decent number of Texas firms that participate in OCI? I'm also considering UVA and I know they have good connections to Texas. Wondering if Penn has the same ties.
There are a pretty good number of TX firms at OCI; Baker Botts, V&E, Gibson Dunn, Hayboo. Can't remember the others, but there's definitely a presence. But if you want TX, there's also a regional interview program before OCI that takes place in TX, some people get their job that way and then don't even do OCI

User avatar
BullPenn
NBA Chatter 1st Banana
Posts: 2742
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2018 5:41 pm

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by BullPenn » Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:42 am

wannabegenius wrote:
Sun Mar 18, 2018 9:24 am
BullPenn wrote:
Thu Feb 01, 2018 11:47 am
LSNlife wrote:
Thu Feb 01, 2018 9:46 am
This may be a little too "in the weeds" but how difficult is it to find housing that includes parking//how common is it for students to bring vehicles with them? I have to have mine due to other commitments outside of Philly and I don't necessarily need to drive to class but I'm a little concerned about the feasibility of finding cheap parking included with housing options close to campus.
Parking tends to be a pain in this particular area of town

You're not going to find many places that "include" parking, and even the places that have parking in their building charge an extra fee

Left Bank tended to be a popular option for those who needed parking, but Left Bank is expensive and shitty. I don't think 2400 Chestnut has a garage? Could be wrong there, their apartments are ok but expensive.

My suggestion is honestly to get a place in University City (like, b/n 38th and 44th) and rely on street parking; it's not so bad to get reliable street parking within 2 blocks honestly
Why do you say Left Bank is shitty? I've been looking at apartments and thus far it has been my first choice. Is there something I should know? Thanks!

Edit: Where would you recommend instead? That's my price range. Value is important as is an easy commute.
as with everything, it's the value /for the price/ that irks me. it's fine and you get a doorman and whatever to make sure your amazon packages don't get yanked (never really been an issue generally, though), but the apartments are bare-bones and minimal and not "nice". they price it out like they're some luxury complex and that just could not be further from the truth.

commute can't be easier and you'll have plenty of other law students that live there

i just think there is so much greater value if you get a little more creative in your search. row houses in grad hospital. walkups and smaller apartment buildings in wash park, that sort of thing. personally i think university city is so underrated

if you absolutely need the doorman-large apartment lifestyle, then have at it and i think 2400 chestnut is a little bit better value

User avatar
RubyRhad
Posts: 933
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2018 10:04 am

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by RubyRhad » Mon Mar 19, 2018 1:27 pm

Any thoughts on The Chatham?

User avatar
BullPenn
NBA Chatter 1st Banana
Posts: 2742
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2018 5:41 pm

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by BullPenn » Mon Mar 19, 2018 4:19 pm

alykdesire wrote:
Mon Mar 19, 2018 1:27 pm
Any thoughts on The Chatham?
don't know anyone who lived there, sorry

sandysan
Posts: 13
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:26 am

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by sandysan » Mon Mar 19, 2018 8:20 pm

does anyone know if Penn will keep your Dean's scholarship if you apply to defer for a year?

User avatar
RubyRhad
Posts: 933
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2018 10:04 am

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by RubyRhad » Tue Mar 20, 2018 3:41 pm

How do sections work? Particularly, how many, how many people in each section, classes with section? Also, what is the largest class size 1L year?

wsbl
Posts: 27
Joined: Sat Jan 27, 2018 1:47 pm

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by wsbl » Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:42 pm

alykdesire wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 3:41 pm
How do sections work? Particularly, how many, how many people in each section, classes with section? Also, what is the largest class size 1L year?
3 sections of ~80.
1L Fall is 2 classes with the full section, 2 classes (including LPS) with half section
1L Spring is 2 classes with the full section, LPS with half section, and 2 electives

User avatar
BullPenn
NBA Chatter 1st Banana
Posts: 2742
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2018 5:41 pm

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by BullPenn » Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:58 pm

wsbl wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:42 pm
alykdesire wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 3:41 pm
How do sections work? Particularly, how many, how many people in each section, classes with section? Also, what is the largest class size 1L year?
3 sections of ~80.
1L Fall is 2 classes with the full section, 2 classes (including LPS) with half section
1L Spring is 2 classes with the full section, LPS with half section, and 2 electives
Should note that the 2 electives can vary a lot in class size depending on what you pick. More traditional-sounding courses will be around 40 folks. Some of the _____-and-law seminars are usually around 15-20.

User avatar
BullPenn
NBA Chatter 1st Banana
Posts: 2742
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2018 5:41 pm

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by BullPenn » Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:00 pm

BullPenn wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:58 pm
wsbl wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:42 pm
alykdesire wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 3:41 pm
How do sections work? Particularly, how many, how many people in each section, classes with section? Also, what is the largest class size 1L year?
3 sections of ~80.
1L Fall is 2 classes with the full section, 2 classes (including LPS) with half section
1L Spring is 2 classes with the full section, LPS with half section, and 2 electives
Should note that the 2 electives can vary a lot in class size depending on what you pick. More traditional-sounding courses will be around 40 folks. Some of the _____-and-law seminars are usually around 15-20.
Also you will have 2Ls and 3Ls in your electives. They'll technically be graded on a different curve, so your 1L class size can be as small as 10. So a small class size is great, but I'd be wary of a screwed up small sample turning a good performance into, like, a B.

As far as I was concerned, 1L wasn't the time to enrich my personal growth towards a lawyer with interesting classes, since you have two whole entire years left to do that. I just chose the largest exam-graded classes that sounded like I wouldn't hate them (Advanced Contracts + Environmental Law were my choices)

User avatar
RubyRhad
Posts: 933
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2018 10:04 am

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by RubyRhad » Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:17 pm

wsbl wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:42 pm
alykdesire wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 3:41 pm
How do sections work? Particularly, how many, how many people in each section, classes with section? Also, what is the largest class size 1L year?
3 sections of ~80.
1L Fall is 2 classes with the full section, 2 classes (including LPS) with half section
1L Spring is 2 classes with the full section, LPS with half section, and 2 electives
Thank you!

User avatar
RubyRhad
Posts: 933
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2018 10:04 am

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by RubyRhad » Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:20 pm

BullPenn wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:00 pm
BullPenn wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:58 pm
wsbl wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:42 pm
alykdesire wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 3:41 pm
How do sections work? Particularly, how many, how many people in each section, classes with section? Also, what is the largest class size 1L year?
3 sections of ~80.
1L Fall is 2 classes with the full section, 2 classes (including LPS) with half section
1L Spring is 2 classes with the full section, LPS with half section, and 2 electives
Should note that the 2 electives can vary a lot in class size depending on what you pick. More traditional-sounding courses will be around 40 folks. Some of the _____-and-law seminars are usually around 15-20.
Also you will have 2Ls and 3Ls in your electives. They'll technically be graded on a different curve, so your 1L class size can be as small as 10. So a small class size is great, but I'd be wary of a screwed up small sample turning a good performance into, like, a B.

As far as I was concerned, 1L wasn't the time to enrich my personal growth towards a lawyer with interesting classes, since you have two whole entire years left to do that. I just chose the largest exam-graded classes that sounded like I wouldn't hate them (Advanced Contracts + Environmental Law were my choices)
Great advice. Thanks. Did you guys feel that the sections were too large? I know some other schools have smaller sections (like around 30), so did you think it was too large?

User avatar
BullPenn
NBA Chatter 1st Banana
Posts: 2742
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2018 5:41 pm

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by BullPenn » Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:34 pm

alykdesire wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:20 pm
BullPenn wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:00 pm
BullPenn wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:58 pm
wsbl wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:42 pm
alykdesire wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 3:41 pm
How do sections work? Particularly, how many, how many people in each section, classes with section? Also, what is the largest class size 1L year?
3 sections of ~80.
1L Fall is 2 classes with the full section, 2 classes (including LPS) with half section
1L Spring is 2 classes with the full section, LPS with half section, and 2 electives
Should note that the 2 electives can vary a lot in class size depending on what you pick. More traditional-sounding courses will be around 40 folks. Some of the _____-and-law seminars are usually around 15-20.
Also you will have 2Ls and 3Ls in your electives. They'll technically be graded on a different curve, so your 1L class size can be as small as 10. So a small class size is great, but I'd be wary of a screwed up small sample turning a good performance into, like, a B.

As far as I was concerned, 1L wasn't the time to enrich my personal growth towards a lawyer with interesting classes, since you have two whole entire years left to do that. I just chose the largest exam-graded classes that sounded like I wouldn't hate them (Advanced Contracts + Environmental Law were my choices)
Great advice. Thanks. Did you guys feel that the sections were too large? I know some other schools have smaller sections (like around 30), so did you think it was too large?
Disclaimer - I haven't attended another school

But I will say that 80 felt perfect. I actually disliked the 40-person split-section classes (note wsbl's comment that you'll have 2 classes of half-section population) more because it felt way too under-the-microscope when you're just learning how to be a law student. 80 was great because you'll always have a chance to ask questions or whatever (if that's your thing) but you're not swimming in other law students. Other sections are like 100-120 in some schools and I think that's a little much.

My general rule of thumb with education is that you make a big thing small but you can't make a small thing big. Office hours, study groups, post-class questions, etc. etc. can make a large setting much, much smaller and manageable. But if you're struggling in a small class it can feel disheartening and you won't have as many fellow colleagues to lean on for resources and advice.

just my 2 cents

User avatar
abujabal
Posts: 213
Joined: Sun Jan 28, 2018 1:45 pm

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by abujabal » Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:40 pm

alykdesire wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:20 pm


Great advice. Thanks. Did you guys feel that the sections were too large? I know some other schools have smaller sections (like around 30), so did you think it was too large?
Is this a UVA vs. Penn section size comparison (judging by the numbers)? I was just coming here to ask that haha

User avatar
RubyRhad
Posts: 933
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2018 10:04 am

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by RubyRhad » Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:48 pm

abujabal wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:40 pm
alykdesire wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:20 pm


Great advice. Thanks. Did you guys feel that the sections were too large? I know some other schools have smaller sections (like around 30), so did you think it was too large?
Is this a UVA vs. Penn section size comparison (judging by the numbers)? I was just coming here to ask that haha
Lololol. Actually yes. At this point, I am deciding between these two schools.

User avatar
BullPenn
NBA Chatter 1st Banana
Posts: 2742
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2018 5:41 pm

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by BullPenn » Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:54 pm

alykdesire wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:48 pm
abujabal wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:40 pm
alykdesire wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:20 pm


Great advice. Thanks. Did you guys feel that the sections were too large? I know some other schools have smaller sections (like around 30), so did you think it was too large?
Is this a UVA vs. Penn section size comparison (judging by the numbers)? I was just coming here to ask that haha
Lololol. Actually yes. At this point, I am deciding between these two schools.
one was a 16 seed in the NCAA tournament

one lost to a 16 seed in the NCAA tournament

no contest IMO

wsbl
Posts: 27
Joined: Sat Jan 27, 2018 1:47 pm

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by wsbl » Tue Mar 20, 2018 8:00 pm

alykdesire wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:48 pm
abujabal wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:40 pm
alykdesire wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:20 pm


Great advice. Thanks. Did you guys feel that the sections were too large? I know some other schools have smaller sections (like around 30), so did you think it was too large?
Is this a UVA vs. Penn section size comparison (judging by the numbers)? I was just coming here to ask that haha
Lololol. Actually yes. At this point, I am deciding between these two schools.
Something to keep in mind is that during your 1L year you will get to know everybody in your section. You'll definitely meet others, too, but your section will essentially be your group for the whole year. See what number feels right for you, but I'd hope I love the 29 other students in my section if I'm spending a whole year with basically just them.

User avatar
oxfordrama
Posts: 48
Joined: Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:23 am

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by oxfordrama » Fri Mar 23, 2018 6:30 pm

OMG, so Rittenhouse Square

❤️

This is where Philly blossomed for me

JohnnieSockran
Posts: 119
Joined: Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:59 pm

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by JohnnieSockran » Tue Mar 27, 2018 12:11 pm

A note about 1L spring elective....technically only 1 will be a regulated elective (think bankruptcy, admin law, etc - the more traditional sounding courses), meaning the grading must follow the 1L curve strictly, while the other elective is not regulated, meaning it does not necessarily have to strictly follow the 1L grade curve (which could mean easier chance at an A).

Also, something I wish I had known during 1L is that the registrar's office leaves binders out on their desks for students to come look at and those binders show the student reviews of a class for like the past 2 years. It also shows the grade breakdown of that course, so you can see what percent of the class got A's, B's etc., if you're looking for electives that are more likely to land you a higher grade with less work.

User avatar
BullPenn
NBA Chatter 1st Banana
Posts: 2742
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2018 5:41 pm

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by BullPenn » Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:47 pm

JohnnieSockran wrote:
Tue Mar 27, 2018 12:11 pm
A note about 1L spring elective....technically only 1 will be a regulated elective (think bankruptcy, admin law, etc - the more traditional sounding courses), meaning the grading must follow the 1L curve strictly, while the other elective is not regulated, meaning it does not necessarily have to strictly follow the 1L grade curve (which could mean easier chance at an A).

Also, something I wish I had known during 1L is that the registrar's office leaves binders out on their desks for students to come look at and those binders show the student reviews of a class for like the past 2 years. It also shows the grade breakdown of that course, so you can see what percent of the class got A's, B's etc., if you're looking for electives that are more likely to land you a higher grade with less work.
good detail, totally forgot about this

User avatar
InvisiblePineapple
Posts: 169
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2018 10:58 am

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by InvisiblePineapple » Thu Mar 29, 2018 7:35 pm

Fresh admit here - what's it like getting to DC out of Penn? And do you think the relatively low clerkship numbers come from everyone self-selecting straight into BigLaw? I'm heavily leaning Chicago, which also doesn't place a whole lot in DC, but at least has better clerkship numbers, which is important to me because I want to do appellate litigation.

User avatar
goat.parkour
Posts: 16
Joined: Sat Jan 27, 2018 12:00 am

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by goat.parkour » Thu Mar 29, 2018 9:55 pm

InvisiblePineapple wrote:
Thu Mar 29, 2018 7:35 pm
Fresh admit here - what's it like getting to DC out of Penn? And do you think the relatively low clerkship numbers come from everyone self-selecting straight into BigLaw? I'm heavily leaning Chicago, which also doesn't place a whole lot in DC, but at least has better clerkship numbers, which is important to me because I want to do appellate litigation.
Congrats on being admitted! tbh I think Penn could do better with supporting people who are looking for clerkships. That being said, they're definitely attainable from Penn and the low clerkship numbers do have a lot to do with many people doing transactional/wanting to immediately make biglaw $ instead of clerk. Several of my friends this year secured A3 clerkships for immediately after graduation, and didn't complain too much about the process (though hopefully the renewed hiring plan will work and make it easier).
As for DC, there are TONS of DC firms that come to OCI, and a good number of people go to DC every year. Obviously you need better grades for DC than for NY, but a lot of that is just because there are fewer DC spots available. If you have ties to DC/a good reason for wanting to be there, that also helps.
Final caveat - appellate lit is a very, very hard target to aim for. So make sure there's an area of law that you will be happy doing if appellate lit doesn't pan out.

manyesh
Posts: 50
Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2018 12:38 pm

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by manyesh » Fri Mar 30, 2018 8:46 am

Can any current Penn students chime in on how soon people should be looking for housing? Should I be looking for apartments now, or is it fine to wait until later this summer when I have more time?

FWIW - I plan on living in a larger apartment building rather than renting a brownstone.

wsbl
Posts: 27
Joined: Sat Jan 27, 2018 1:47 pm

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by wsbl » Fri Mar 30, 2018 9:17 am

manyesh wrote:
Fri Mar 30, 2018 8:46 am
Can any current Penn students chime in on how soon people should be looking for housing? Should I be looking for apartments now, or is it fine to wait until later this summer when I have more time?

FWIW - I plan on living in a larger apartment building rather than renting a brownstone.
The search for a larger apartment building will be easier and quicker than a brownstone. You can even start just getting an idea of what is around on the complex's websites. Won't need more than 1-2 months of time before move-in.

User avatar
BullPenn
NBA Chatter 1st Banana
Posts: 2742
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2018 5:41 pm

Re: Penn Students & Graduates Taking Questions

Post by BullPenn » Fri Mar 30, 2018 10:12 am

goat.parkour wrote:
Thu Mar 29, 2018 9:55 pm
InvisiblePineapple wrote:
Thu Mar 29, 2018 7:35 pm
Fresh admit here - what's it like getting to DC out of Penn? And do you think the relatively low clerkship numbers come from everyone self-selecting straight into BigLaw? I'm heavily leaning Chicago, which also doesn't place a whole lot in DC, but at least has better clerkship numbers, which is important to me because I want to do appellate litigation.
Congrats on being admitted! tbh I think Penn could do better with supporting people who are looking for clerkships. That being said, they're definitely attainable from Penn and the low clerkship numbers do have a lot to do with many people doing transactional/wanting to immediately make biglaw $ instead of clerk. Several of my friends this year secured A3 clerkships for immediately after graduation, and didn't complain too much about the process (though hopefully the renewed hiring plan will work and make it easier).
As for DC, there are TONS of DC firms that come to OCI, and a good number of people go to DC every year. Obviously you need better grades for DC than for NY, but a lot of that is just because there are fewer DC spots available. If you have ties to DC/a good reason for wanting to be there, that also helps.
Final caveat - appellate lit is a very, very hard target to aim for. So make sure there's an area of law that you will be happy doing if appellate lit doesn't pan out.
yeah doing appellate lit doesn't become easier just because you go to a school that has more clerkships in quantity

lots of self-selection at Penn out of clerkships. as with public interest, my anecdotal experience from dozens of friends in clerkships is that the competition isn't nearly as bad and you get a bit more personal attention from the [excellent] staff in charge of such things

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests