Because the good bootcamps train you to code languages for web dev and how to pass tech whiteboard interviews. Essentially, your goal is to get a job as a web developer. Learning Ruby for 16 hours a day around other people with the same goals, for 4 months straight, and learning to develop an app from scratch while having them answer your questions helps achieve this.coffee_spoons wrote: ↑Thu May 03, 2018 2:53 pmI have no doubt you're right about this, but if you can't compete with these people in a CS classroom, how the fuck are you supposed to compete with them for jobs after spending 4 months learning to code from scratch?FuzzyDunlop wrote: ↑Wed May 02, 2018 12:39 pm
You know how in law school, the law students feared or hated the curve? Oh, you're going to be so thankful it's there in computer science to save you. It'll be a good experience for you, where unlike in law school you're mostly competing against Americans, in CS you get to take math classes with students from China, Korea, Singapore, Japan, Russia and India. Have fun with your math 300 linear algebra class with the students from China who will cruise through it and your data structures class with people who have been programming since high school. Wang Lei and Zhang Jun in your math classes are going to make that law school gunner you thought was smart, look like a joke.
https://blog.codinghorror.com/why-cant- ... s-program/
Their goal is not to get you into a Master's program, for you to feel comfortable 7 years from now as you do research in your PhD program, or for you to have a university level graduate hold of physics or 4th year mathematics. You're not going to struggle for months to get a curved D- in Quantum Computation while also trying to fulfill a college foreign language and arts elective you have no interest in.
People who go aren't undecided as to whether they want to be a web developer, design games at Microsoft XBox, run a physics engine for Blizzard, work on AI, switch into robotics, write software for cars, or learn low-level program for assembly and CPU architecture.
Most of these bootcamps, their goal is to make you a full stack web developer, and hopefully from work on your part, competent enough to pass a web developer interview.
So no, you can't compete against the above mentioned people if your immediate goals fall outside of this. But a lot of those above mentioned people, even the ones out of PhD programs, may also fail a web developer interview (whereas a dropout can pass) because they didn't focus enough on full stack web development or never did it in school.
This whole "terrible no-name" thing I keep seeing here -- it's a very annoying typical attorney attitude. You guys do realize that prior to being well-known and financially successful, a lot of these bootcamps were "no-name" right? That they were just these "no-name" startups you guys keep looking down on that just grew rapidly into success? And the same goes for every other single significant software company you guys probably want to work for? FYI, saying stupid shit like that is going to irk a lot of people in industry. You may think working at a 200 year-old slow moving law firm with a skechy history is "status" compared to a "no-name" startup, but to a lot of people, especially outside of law, you just sound lame.Guest wrote: ↑Fri May 04, 2018 12:03 pmInteresting discussion going on!
FuzzyDunlop, you mentioned "reputable". What criteria do you use? Other than some obviously terrible no-name ones, there seems to be a general cluster of decent bootcamps (Flatiron/Fullstack/Hackbright/Galvanize/General Assembly etc. etc.). And then there's HackReactor and App Academy, which everybody seems to consider the best of the best. They also seem to boast higher salaries.
I ask because I got into the Galvanize bootcamp and I'm trying to decide whether to go, or to hold out for HackReactor/App Academy? Are those two really going to give you that much more preparation?
To answer your question, I base "reputable" on bootcamp reviews and how many software developers they trained into jobs. Whether their Founders/Instructors seem reputable (did they have careers at software companies I recognize or were full stack developers at startups themselves).
Whether their students leave positive and happy reviews. Or are the reviews suspicious, like they barely gave any guidance on how to program after admitting students, do the instructors answer questions or was it 99% "just Google it." Also, their general philosophy, for instance the bootcamp I mentioned that doesn't charge an upfront fee but you pay after you've landed your job.
Regardless, this isn't law school. No one is going to start a blog crying about and ranking all the bootcamps in a huge list. All the materials they give you at bootcamp (and in a college programming class) is available online for free. There are excellent free online tutorials on Python, PHP, Ruby and Java that software engineers use at work that you have complete access to.
It's you, not the bootcamp. The bootcamp just puts you around other people so you're motivated to code all day and night, with the benefit of instructors to immediately answer your questions so you're not stuck looking everything up or getting crap advice on your code from a programming forum similar to how crap advice on being an attorney is given out on law school forums. If you think that's worth your $10,000, then it's worth going. If not, then save the $10,000 and start reading tutorials.