LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

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Expand view Topic review: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by Nebby » Wed Apr 01, 2020 2:16 pm

FYI all - the CARES Act (signed by the president on 3/27) makes some changes that affect PSLF.

In sum, everyone with federal loans will automatically go on forebearance until Sept 30, 2020. All monthly payments that would have qualified during this period will still be counted for PSLF purposes. This is a change to the ordinary rule that months on foreberance DO NOT count to PSLF. A friend of mine who works at DOEd posted about this and I double checked to ensure that is indeed the case. Below is the language from the CARES Act and a link to the page with the full law.
SEC. 3513. TEMPORARY RELIEF FOR FEDERAL STUDENT LOAN BORROWERS.
(a) In General.—The Secretary shall suspend all payments due for loans made under part D and part B (that are held by the Department of Education) of title IV of the Higher Education Act of 1965 (20 U.S.C. 1087a et seq.; 1071 et seq.) through September 30, 2020.

(b) No Accrual Of Interest.—Notwithstanding any other provision of the Higher Education Act of 1965 (20 U.S.C. 1001 et seq.), interest shall not accrue on a loan described under subsection (a) for which payment was suspended for the period of the suspension.

(c) Consideration Of Payments.—Notwithstanding any other provision of the Higher Education Act of 1965 (20 U.S.C. 1001 et seq.), the Secretary shall deem each month for which a loan payment was suspended under this section as if the borrower of the loan had made a payment for the purpose of any loan forgiveness program or loan rehabilitation program authorized under part D or B of title IV of the Higher Education Act of 1965 (20 U.S.C. 1087a et seq.; 1071 et seq.) for which the borrower would have otherwise qualified.

(d) Reporting To Consumer Reporting Agencies.—During the period in which the Secretary suspends payments on a loan under subsection (a), the Secretary shall ensure that, for the purpose of reporting information about the loan to a consumer reporting agency, any payment that has been suspended is treated as if it were a regularly scheduled payment made by a borrower.

(e) Suspending Involuntary Collection.—During the period in which the Secretary suspends payments on a loan under subsection (a), the Secretary shall suspend all involuntary collection related to the loan, including—
(1) a wage garnishment authorized under section 488A of the Higher Education Act of 1965 (20 U.S.C. 1095a) or section 3720D of title 31, United States Code;
(2) a reduction of tax refund by amount of debt authorized under section 3720A of title 31, United States Code, or section 6402(d) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986;
(3) a reduction of any other Federal benefit payment by administrative offset authorized under section 3716 of title 31, United States Code (including a benefit payment due to an individual under the Social Security Act or any other provision described in subsection (c)(3)(A)(i) of such section); and
(4) any other involuntary collection activity by the Secretary.

(f) Waivers.—In carrying out this section, the Secretary may waive the application of—
(1) subchapter I of chapter 35 of title 44, United States Code (commonly known as the “Paperwork Reduction Act”);
(2) the master calendar requirements under section 482 of the Higher Education Act of 1965 (20 U.S.C. 1089);
(3) negotiated rulemaking under section 492 of the Higher Education Act of 1965 (20 U.S.C. 1098a); and
(4) the requirement to publish the notices related to the system of records of the agency before implementation required under paragraphs (4) and (11) of section 552a(e) of title 5, United States Code (commonly known as the “Privacy Act of 1974”), except that the notices shall be published not later than 180 days after the date of enactment of this Act.

(g) Notice To Borrowers And Transition Period.—To inform borrowers of the actions taken in accordance with this section and ensure an effective transition, the Secretary shall—
(1) not later than 15 days after the date of enactment of this Act, notify borrowers—
(A) of the actions taken in accordance with subsections (a) and (b) for whom payments have been suspended and interest waived;
(B) of the actions taken in accordance with subsection (e) for whom collections have been suspended;
(C) of the option to continue making payments toward principal; and
(D) that the program under this section is a temporary program.
(2) beginning on August 1, 2020, carry out a program to provide not less than 6 notices by postal mail, telephone, or electronic communication to borrowers indicating—
(A) when the borrower’s normal payment obligations will resume; and
(B) that the borrower has the option to enroll in income-driven repayment, including a brief description of such options.
https://www.congress.gov/116/bills/hr74 ... 748enr.xml

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by Nebby » Mon Feb 10, 2020 7:21 pm

twenty wrote:
Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:37 pm
It's that time of the year again!

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/the-t ... 2019-03-12
It's that time of the year again!

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by icechicken » Sun Dec 15, 2019 12:17 pm

archipm wrote:
Mon Dec 09, 2019 2:57 pm
idk if there was a different thread for different school's LRAPs but UChicago mildly improved theirs this year!
Yeah, looks like it's still positive-amortized (which makes it a little less awesome that clerkships and fellowships are covered) but in all other respects it seems comparable to the rest of the T6 now.

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by necho2 » Tue Dec 10, 2019 12:45 am

archipm wrote:
Mon Dec 09, 2019 2:57 pm
idk if there was a different thread for different school's LRAPs but UChicago mildly improved theirs this year!
+1

Also discovering that the whole "clerkships are covered" thing is not nearly as standard as I initially believed...

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by archipm » Mon Dec 09, 2019 2:57 pm

idk if there was a different thread for different school's LRAPs but UChicago mildly improved theirs this year!

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by Nebby » Mon Dec 09, 2019 2:46 pm

Thread

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by Nebby » Mon Dec 09, 2019 2:38 pm

Some data (thread)

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by UVA2B » Thu Mar 21, 2019 5:21 pm

ageofsuf wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 5:18 pm
UVA2B wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 12:54 pm
ageofsuf wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 12:20 pm
I can't seem to find any Democratic candidates willing to address current student debt. Everything is about making college "affordable" or "free," but nothing about addressing the trillion dollar debt crisis.
While minimally related to the thread topic here, this doesn’t belong here. If you have questions about the nuts and bolts of repayment and forgiveness programs as currently constituted, it belongs here. Discussion of political candidates and their particular policy stances have several threads in the lounge where this can be discussed.

Consider this your warning.
Can we skip the warning and you can instead delete my account? I don't need to have one.
Sure thing. Sorry you didn't get what you wanted here.

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by ageofsuf » Thu Mar 21, 2019 5:18 pm

UVA2B wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 12:54 pm
ageofsuf wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 12:20 pm
I can't seem to find any Democratic candidates willing to address current student debt. Everything is about making college "affordable" or "free," but nothing about addressing the trillion dollar debt crisis.
While minimally related to the thread topic here, this doesn’t belong here. If you have questions about the nuts and bolts of repayment and forgiveness programs as currently constituted, it belongs here. Discussion of political candidates and their particular policy stances have several threads in the lounge where this can be discussed.

Consider this your warning.
Can we skip the warning and you can instead delete my account? I don't need to have one.

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by Nebby » Thu Mar 21, 2019 1:06 pm

UVA2B wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 12:54 pm
ageofsuf wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 12:20 pm
I can't seem to find any Democratic candidates willing to address current student debt. Everything is about making college "affordable" or "free," but nothing about addressing the trillion dollar debt crisis.
While minimally related to the thread topic here, this doesn’t belong here. If you have questions about the nuts and bolts of repayment and forgiveness programs as currently constituted, it belongs here. Discussion of political candidates and their particular policy stances have several threads in the lounge where this can be discussed.

Consider this your warning.
100% likelihood that this is 24K or whatever his username is

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by UVA2B » Thu Mar 21, 2019 12:54 pm

ageofsuf wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 12:20 pm
I can't seem to find any Democratic candidates willing to address current student debt. Everything is about making college "affordable" or "free," but nothing about addressing the trillion dollar debt crisis.
While minimally related to the thread topic here, this doesn’t belong here. If you have questions about the nuts and bolts of repayment and forgiveness programs as currently constituted, it belongs here. Discussion of political candidates and their particular policy stances have several threads in the lounge where this can be discussed.

Consider this your warning.

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by Nebby » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:12 pm

The proposal would only apply to loans originated after July 2020 (it's obviously bad nonetheless, but wouldn't fuck anyone currently out of school and on the path towards PSLF).

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by twenty » Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:37 pm

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by Kümmel » Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:41 pm

Nebby wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:23 pm
You're right!
shocking

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by Nebby » Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:38 pm

I am not seeing that in either my promissory note or on here: https://www.law.columbia.edu/sites/defa ... eb2019.pdf

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by Kümmel » Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:27 pm

deleted by request...

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by Nebby » Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:23 pm

You're right!

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by Kümmel » Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:14 pm

deleted by request...

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by twenty » Tue Feb 05, 2019 11:59 am

HmmOhkay wrote:
Sat Feb 02, 2019 11:57 am
It suggests that they aren't engaging in a heated competition in this area (appealing to prospective students who want to go into PI that may not pay well).
I know I cared a lot about this when I was applying to T14 schools (I didn't apply to Cornell + some others for this exact reason). Over ten years the difference can be ~60k you didn't have to spend on loan repayments by opting for Columbia over Northwestern. You obviously never know what kind of job you'll get, what your grades will be, etc. etc., so the more-certain items with regards to PI weighed pretty heavily for me.

Harvard at 45 and 46k.
So it's worth pointing out that the Harvard, Yale, Stanford + many of the older LRAP programs do not neg-am over ten years with one huge payoff at the end. The argument is that if you're only going to stay in PI for a few years, you're better off at one of these programs because your loan balance will actually decrease over this time. I don't think it deserves as much weight as people give it, but it is worth pointing out.

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by Echos Myron » Mon Feb 04, 2019 4:20 pm

HmmOhkay wrote:
Sat Feb 02, 2019 11:57 am
Nebby wrote:
Sat Feb 02, 2019 10:08 am


Hmmm. That spreadsheet was made in 2016 so likely out of date. NU got a huge infusion of cash ($40 million) earmarked for PI in 2016 so it's likely that it's changed.

EDIT: Nevermind, it's still the same. Yeah, that's not great.
It's interesting that there's so much variation among the top schools. It suggests that they aren't engaging in a heated competition in this area (appealing to prospective students who want to go into PI that may not pay well). You've got schools like NYU, Chicago, and Cornell that will cover full payments for salaries under 80k and schools about half that amount with Northwestern and Harvard at 45 and 46k. I guess there's not much pressure on them to match each other in this area. Or maybe they don't care much about PI.
Need to distinguish between PSLF-integrated and non-PSLF programs and their benefits/drawbacks. For example, the NU and HLS LRAPs vastly different aside from their income caps

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by HmmOhkay » Sat Feb 02, 2019 11:57 am

Nebby wrote:
Sat Feb 02, 2019 10:08 am


Hmmm. That spreadsheet was made in 2016 so likely out of date. NU got a huge infusion of cash ($40 million) earmarked for PI in 2016 so it's likely that it's changed.

EDIT: Nevermind, it's still the same. Yeah, that's not great.
It's interesting that there's so much variation among the top schools. It suggests that they aren't engaging in a heated competition in this area (appealing to prospective students who want to go into PI that may not pay well). You've got schools like NYU, Chicago, and Cornell that will cover full payments for salaries under 80k and schools about half that amount with Northwestern and Harvard at 45 and 46k. I guess there's not much pressure on them to match each other in this area. Or maybe they don't care much about PI.

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by Nebby » Sat Feb 02, 2019 10:08 am

HmmOhkay wrote:
Sat Feb 02, 2019 9:01 am
Nebby wrote:
Fri Feb 01, 2019 8:06 am
Guest wrote:
Fri Feb 01, 2019 12:35 am
Is there a list out there of the salary caps (under which the person's payments are fully covered) that would allow comparison among schools with LRAP programs, or at least the T14?
I *think* the spreadsheet in my PI thread has that info (T14 only): viewtopic.php?f=23&t=157
Yikes, Northwestern's is <45k for full coverage? that's embarrassing. Seems like full coverage under 60k should be the minimum, particularly since there doesn't seem to be any adjustment for cost of living. Think about what it would be like making 50k and living in SF/DC/NY and not qualifying for full LRAP...
Hmmm. That spreadsheet was made in 2016 so likely out of date. NU got a huge infusion of cash ($40 million) earmarked for PI in 2016 so it's likely that it's changed.

EDIT: Nevermind, it's still the same. Yeah, that's not great.

Re: LRAP/IBR/PSLF. How does it work? Let's find out!

by HmmOhkay » Sat Feb 02, 2019 9:01 am

Nebby wrote:
Fri Feb 01, 2019 8:06 am
Guest wrote:
Fri Feb 01, 2019 12:35 am
Is there a list out there of the salary caps (under which the person's payments are fully covered) that would allow comparison among schools with LRAP programs, or at least the T14?
I *think* the spreadsheet in my PI thread has that info (T14 only): viewtopic.php?f=23&t=157
Yikes, Northwestern's is <45k for full coverage? that's embarrassing. Seems like full coverage under 60k should be the minimum, particularly since there doesn't seem to be any adjustment for cost of living. Think about what it would be like making 50k and living in SF/DC/NY and not qualifying for full LRAP...

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